Godless Business

The Pope IS a Nazi

Much has been written about Richard Dawkins “Pope Nazi” comment at the Global Atheist Conference after a member of the audience asked him about the canonisation of Mary Mackillop. Dawkins now famously replied that the entire process was “pure Monty Python” and went on to deride the process requiring two verified miracles and the accusation that he only targets “the fundamental nut bags”. Dawkins was making the point that real theologians (whatever they are) believe that praying over somebody will cure them of cancer and cited Mary and “Pope Nazi” as examples, and these were the people we are meant to be taking seriously!

(Richard Dawkins from Young Australian Skeptics on Vimeo.)

It should be clear to anyone who watches the footage that Dawkins was referring to the ongoing canonisation of Pope Pius XII, who signed a concordant with the Nazis in 1933. In the historic document the Pontiff stipulated various protections for the Catholic Church, but conspicuously no restrictions where placed on the Nazis to curb their evil, megalomaniacal plans. A force for good in the world? I don’t think so.

Furthermore, it is a well known fact that Pope Benedict XVI (Ratzinger) was a member of the Hitler Youth after he turned 14 – as many were at that time. However, being a member of  an organisation does not automatically mean adopting their stated beliefs or mission (although it should). For example, not many Boy Scouts would adopt the insane Christian theology of Lord Baden-Powell, whose organisation has publicly declared atheist, agnostics, and homosexuals are not welcome within their ranks. Now where would they get ideas like that? Interestingly, early Boy Scout badges featured the swastika – perhaps the two organisations are not that far apart after all?

Anyway, to my mind what makes Pope Ratzinger a Nazi is not that he necessarily holds to the dogmas of eugenics, a pure Aryan race, and the extermination of the religious group responsible for Christ’s death – although for over 300 years the Catholic Church restricted the Jewish people to special quarters within the Vatican walls, commonly called the ghettos. One wonders if this attitude had any impact on Hitlers attitude towards the Jewish people.

No, it’s that the Pope assumes himself to be the most perfect incarnation of Christ on Earth. His words are considered inerrant and eternal (thanks to the First Vatican Council’s declaration of ex cathedra in 1870), and that any dissent will result in excommunication and expulsion from the power hungry, obscenely rich, and outlandishly superstitious death cult.

When Catholics suspend their rational minds and blindly adhere to the Pope’s words because a few men in dresses took a vote and made him perfect, what naturally follows is a totalitarian dictatorship. The Catholic Church is lead by a egotistical, self important, maximally deranged man who instructs billions on what to think and how to act.

That is what makes the Pope a Nazi.

References

  • DooMDrat

    The link to the Boy Scouts page is broken. It should be .html, not .htm

  • Rodney M

    Wake up to yourself you idiot. The pope doesn't consider himself an incarnation of Christ and
    nor does anyone else with any sense. You also have no idea about the doctrine regarding infallible teaching
    on faith and morals. Learn some theology or at least a modicum of history. Failing that, crawl back under the
    rock you recently emerged from.

    • http://intensedebate.com/profiles/dreadpiratemick dreadpiratemick

      Well, I'm convinced.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/LuminousMonkey LuminousMonkey

      Infallible teaching is supposed to come from the Pope's Apostolic authority, and the Catholic church believes it is the only such church with that authority. So you mean to imply that the Pope doesn't think himself the closest ideal to Jesus because of this?

      • Rodney M

        No, I'm not implying it, I'm stating it as a fact. Infallible teaching on FAITH and MORALS means that any doctrine so proclaimed must be accepted by true Catholics. It doesn't mean that once someone is elected Pope they are not capable of making mistakes. The invoking of "ex cathedra" is used VERY sparingly for obvious reasons. Also, I'm amazed that people like Dawkins are so arrogant given that there was such a pathetic turn out for a "Global Convention". If any rock concert or any NRL game had a crowd that size it would be considered a failure.

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/askegg askegg

          "… any doctrine so proclaimed must be accepted by true Catholics."

          Yeah – it's called dogma and goes against rational thought and free inquiry.

          "The invoking of "ex cathedra" is used VERY sparingly for obvious reasons."

          That even devote Catholics find it almost impossible to accept?

          "Also, I'm amazed that people like Dawkins are so arrogant …"

          Arrogant is telling people what you say is perfect and without error, or that you speak for the creator of the universe.

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/LuminousMonkey LuminousMonkey

          How often it is used is besides the point, if a government was "legally" allowed to detain people with no evidence at all, if such a law was used sparingly does not excuse the law in the first place.

          You can't see the problem with a so call infallible teaching being made by fallible mortals?

          Besides, I think there's more than enough history to show that the catholic church is the last place you should be getting any morals from.

          Your dig against Dawkins is also pointless and nothing to do with the argument. I personally find it amusing you decided to describe him as arrogant, guess why?

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/askegg askegg

      "…and nor does anyone else with any sense."

      It's such a shame so many Catholics actually have no sense at all.

      "Failing that, crawl back under the rock you recently emerged from."

      It is my desire that the Catholic Church crawls back into the slime from which it came.

      • Rodney M

        LOL, spoken like a true believer in evolution. Yeah, we all supposedly evolved from slime. Anyone with eyes can look at an ape holding its young and be reminded of a human mother. It's a bit different looking at slime on a rock and trying to imagine that any amount of select breeding over billions of years would have brought forth Mozart, Beethoven, Einstein, Shakespeare etc. By the way, don't hold your breath waiting for us to go away. We've been here for two thousand years and the Church will still be here long after Dawkins and his kind are dead, buried and forgotten.

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/askegg askegg

          Your arguments from incredulity have no effect here. Move along.

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/LuminousMonkey LuminousMonkey

          Sure, I'm a true believer in evolution too, because there's evidence. The fact you choose to ignore it doesn't make it go away.

          If you want to convince people that evolution as a theory is false, then I recommend you actually read up on evolution and try and find flaws in the evidence. Trying to argue along the lines of "Slime to Mozart LOL", just goes to show you haven't even understood the most basic ideas of evolution.

  • Bexley

    1. The point about boy scouts and the swastika seems like a mere cheap shot and an attempt at guilt by association. If you went to India today you'd still see plenty of swastikas around the place.

    2. Your understanding of what Catholics believe (as pointed out above) is just wrong. The whole infallibility thing is rarely invoked (according to wiki its been only ever been invoked once). So I dont think any of Ratzi's pronouncements are considered infallible by catholics.

    3. You did a rather good job godwinning this thread. Its not enough to be a totalitarian ruler to be called a nazi, I'd say you'd also need to incite racial hatred and deport people to death camps and carry out genocide. The Pope doesnt come near fulfilling this.

    The more you learn about Ratzi the less there is to like but your post has managed to avoid a lot of his problems and pick at misundestandings and trivialities.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/askegg askegg

      1. I draw the swastika reference as "interesting" and also pointed to the bigoted, discriminatory policies of the Boy Scouts.

      2. I realise the Pope can only invoke infallibility in matters of faith and morals, but I would say that many Catholics are unaware of this restriction of the Pontiff's pronouncements. In any case, it only raises even more absurd notions – is the Pope always infallible in relation to these topics? Can the Pope choose to be infallible, and how does he do this? Can you name anything which is not affected by your morality? Etc.

      3. That's YOUR definition of Nazi. In plain language I can call any asshole a Nazi and it is widely understood what is meant.

      • http://www.facebook.com/NRParsons Nathan Parsons

        I've always wondered whether or not Catholics would consider the Pope infallible if he was to proclaim that there was no God. It would set up a rather confusing paradox though.

        And I think the meaning of the term "Nazi" is dependent on the context; it has both an historical meaning and a metaphorical one. I'd definitely agree that you can call an asshole a Nazi.

  • bexley

    askegg:

    "When I use a word' Humpty Dumpty said in rather scornful tone, 'it means just what I choose it to mean, neither more nor less"

    When people have called the pope a Nazi recently they have meant it literally and pointed to his past in the Hitler Youth. So it isnt clear that you are just calling him an asshole. Just stick to calling him an enabler of paedophilia.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Cynskeptical Cynskeptical

    Are you intentionally being arrogant and at the same time ignorant?
    Firstly we do NOT have a belief in evolution, the massive pile of scientific evidence alone puts it far beyond that of a belief. You believe that god exists, we hold no such belief.

    And as for evolution, go read a little about it, because it is obvious to me that you either know very little about it, or that you are purposely just being a troll and stating false claims against it. So I suggest that you go read up on it and get the correct information rather than some half baked bullshit that you have been reading.

    As for you not going away and being here for two thousand years and in no hurry to leave. Well the earth has been around for approx 4.5billion years. Which makes your religion but a spec in time. In fact even if you go back to 500bc giving you 2500 odd years, it is only 0.004% of the total time the earth has been around. And we have a LONG way to get before the earth is swallowed up by the sun. So no I do not think you or your kind will be around for much longer, especially not as long as you are hoping.

    Now as mentioned feel free to make yourself disappear. A vanishing act if you will. Show us some magic, it is magic after all that you believe in right?

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